Sub-classes - Require a Detailed Explanation

[Zaraf]

Can someone who fully understands subclasses please explain everything about them in detail here? How it works, its limitations, etc.

So far my understanding of it is that when you pick a sub-class, you get all of the skills of that class except for the one unique skill that each class has and the basic skills that everyone gets (meaning you don't get a second set of those basic skills).

Is this correct? Do you have to use your normal level up skill points on sub-class skills or do you get some additional points to be able to put them into sub-classes?

Here are the total number of skill points required to max out every single skill of a given class.

Generic skills - 70 points (all classes have these, chop, hp up, etc.)
7 skills with max level 10 each, so 70 points total

Class Specific:
Prince/Princess - 165
Warrior - 180
Phalanx - 165
Pirate - 175
Shinobi - 166
Monk - 180
Zodiac - 150
Beast King - 180
Ballista - 165
Farmer - 152
Shogun - 170
Android - 170

The numbers next to each class represents the max number of points you would need to master every single class specific skill.

Now, if you include a sub-class, let's assume you pick Monk main and Beast King sub (two classes with 180 points), then the total number of points you would need to max out everything is:

180 + 180 + 70 - 10 = 420

I subtract 10 points due to not having the unique skill of the sub-class.

That's a lot of points required.

The way I see it, if you have 70 points (or max 100 if you can level up that high from completing the bonus missions), then you can't even master 1/4 of the skills.

Is this really the case? Does sub-classing lead to the diluting of your characters? Or does it let you ignore spending points on garbage skills and focus on maxing the good ones?

Maybe some insight from people who are experienced with this please?

Thanks

[Kaname]

[eharper256]

Well, diluting the bases is the entire point of multi-classing. It's the case of deciding whether you want to be able to be good at about 3-4 things or decent at twice that number.

Etrian has always been like a pen & paper RPG in that respect, forcing you to make tough but interesting choices about development.

It lets you flesh out characters nicely. Not all Princesses are the same, for example. In my eye, this also encourages you to have a GUILD, with multiple instances of the same class that have different skill sets and abilities (which the whole re-coloured pallette thing also helps with) and 3-4 combat teams of different purpose each, rather than five cookie cutter heroes.

[Kaname]

Or really great at one thing. For example the shogun thing, or the case of a Phalanx subclassing into something that boosts defense to help the Phalanx survive those provoked 10-hit combos some bosses dish out. (Evasion, for example)


Ah, and I forgot:
Multiclassing does not change what the class can wear directly. A Zodiac/Warrior can still only wear what a Zodiac can normally wear. Equipment options only change if you buy the respective mastery. If you buy hammer mastery, you can equip them on the zodiac.

This means you can only make your class use different weapons and maybe a shield (Phalanx). Everything else is off limits, no heavy armor for the Zodiac, ever. ^^

[Zaraf]

Thanks for all of this info, it's very helpful! If you have anything else you think of to add, please do so

I got a question regarding retiring. Can you essentially retire as many times as you like, and thus effectively have a way to acquire infinite skill points (although slow)? Like say you retire at level 99, do you get 9 extra points when your character starts over? Now get your character to level 99 again and retire...does your character get an additional 9 skill points when they start over? Or do they get the retiring bonus only once?

[Self]

I think the characters only gets the bonuses from their most recent retirement just like in the previous 2 games.

[Kaname]

What Self said is correct. Like Etrian 2 - the boni do not stack. The new recruit simply gets the following - nothing more and nothing less:
-Stat and Skillboni based on the current level of the retired character
-All Statpoint boni by stat-items (yes, that's right. There are rare items that boost stats permanently, and I tested myself: They do indeed stay for the new character you get)


Current boni I know:
Level 30-39: 4 Points and +1 Stats
Level 40-49: 5 Points and +2 Stats
Level 50-59: 6 Points and +3 Stats
Level 60-69: 7 Points and +4 Stats
Level 70-79: 8 Points and +5 Stats

[Zaraf]

Ahh good to know.

Is level 30 the lowest level you can retire at? And if not, is it 3 points + no stats for 20 - 29?

Anyone able to please test 80-89 and 90-99 for what they receive as points and stat bonuses please? I don't have a play file in which I can test it. Maybe just use cheats to level up quickly lol

[Kaname]

It's the lowest level you can retire at - 29 and below doesn't work.

[Self]

[Kaname]

Hm, interesting. Guess that absolves me of retiring again before 99.

Edit: But then, I just killed [spoiler]the first dragon,[/spoiler] so it's not as if I COULD level to 99 yet, anyway.

Interestingly, Sek 3's postgame feels a lot harder than 2 or 1. I'm certainly using more items and planning battles more.

[Sampson]

That's what I read over at Gamefaqs. Although I don't read much on the Sq3 forums since they tend to be more loose with spoilers over there. But that's good, since EOI's was more "why won't you drop the ice scale for the love of GOD" and "it takes so long to grind to 70" hard. The actual stratum was hard to the point of being fun once you got a strategy going. Oh, and the suicide-provoking maps.

EOII arguably had a more broken skill set (Painless+Revenge was just broken), and the post-game stratum was easier to navigate. The enemies were easier, too. I once took out more than half of the true final boss's HP with one Counter (with Painless, of course).

And since EOIII seems like it's easier if you're smarter (more so than the previous games), a harder post-game is welcome.

[Kaname]

Post game really throws a few fun tricks at you. I won't spoil them, but some really made me giggle and appreciate the work of the designers. They really had a few new ideas that feel pretty fresh ^_^

Oh, and [spoiler]pumpkinheads[/spoiler] suck, seriously. Not even FOEs anymore. Not as bad as muckdiles, but annoying xD;

[Zaraf]

[Kaname]